Mehdi Hasan vs self-described fascist: ‘They were worse off camera’

Read time: 3 minutes

In brief

• Journalist Mehdi Hasan appeared on YouTube show Surrounded, where he debated 20 far-right conservatives, including one who openly described himself as a fascist and praised Nazi theorists.
• Hasan says the participants were "in many ways" worse than the KKK because they're young, tech-savvy, and use social media platforms to spread white supremacist views.
• Having gained over five million views, Hasan acknowledges criticism that the format gives extremists a platform to become famous online, and says he “wouldn’t do it again”.

What’s the story?

Mehdi Hasan says the far-right conservatives he debated on a viral YouTube show were “in many ways” worse than the Ku Klux Klan, and that they said “worse things off camera” than was seen online.

The left-wing journalist recently featured in an episode of Surrounded, where a person with strong political views is challenged by 20 people who believe the opposite.

During the show, one white American named Connor Estelle described himself as a fascist, praised Nazi theorist Carl Schmitt and said he has no problem with being called a Nazi himself.

Others told Hasan, a naturalised American citizen, to “get out” and that he’s “not American”.

“I had to take security with me to this event,” Hasan tells The News Agents.

“I'm a brown immigrant sitting in a room filled with white supremacists telling me to get out of their country.”

If you thought watching the shocking statements unfold on YouTube was terrifying enough, Hasan says what happened when the cameras weren’t rolling was even worse.

“I'm limited to what I can say happened off camera,” Hasan says.

“But let me tell you this, there was no difference between them on camera and off camera.

“In fact, they said worse things off camera.”

Hasan was initially drawn to going on the show because he “wanted to go where the youth are”, but found their far-right ideology, combined with their youth, frightening.

He believes the people he faced are worse than the Ku Klux Klan.

“In many ways, they are, because these are people who are young and hip and understand social media and have podcasts and platforms," Hasan says.

“They are not the traditional white supremacists we have known in this country who put hoods on and burn crosses on front lawns. This is your next door neighbor. These are the people you work with in your workplace.”

Connor Estelle, the self-described fascist, has since lost his job - which Hasan finds surprising.

“There's 19 other people who aren't losing their jobs,” he says.

“They talked about white genocide and great replacement and told me on camera to get out. You would think, a few years ago, those would be fireable or cancelable offenses. They're clearly not.”

Hasan believes views such as those he was faced with on the show have become normalised since Donald Trump took the presidency.

“How can you cancel these people when the president of the United States has said things as bad, or worse?” he asks.

He thinks “the fascist Genie, the white supremacist Genie, is out of a bottle” and Trump has "emboldened" people to say things out loud that they otherwise never would have.

“There are now millions of people in America who have been emboldened this way,” he says.

The episode has been an online success, racking up over five million views on YouTube at the time of writing - but has also attracted criticism for platforming extremist views – such as those seen from Estelle and the 19 other right-wingers who took part in the debate with Hasan.

Hasan acknowledges that some of the criticism he’s received for going on the show and platforming extremists is "legitimate", but adds that in his defence, he had “literally no idea that they would be this extreme.” “Is there a distinction between fascist, racist white supremacists and the core of the Trump MAGA base?” he asks.

“Should I have been so naive to believe that there are non-fascist, racist, white supremacist Trump supporters in the core of his base? That's a whole debate to be had.”

Ultimately, does he regret going on the show?

“Some days yes, some days no,” he says.

“I can see the value of having done it. But also, clearly I accept the criticisms of the format that allows these people to become famous online for a few days.”

So, would he do it again?

“Definitely not,” he concludes.

Listen to the latest episode of The News Agents.